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JamesF

Verbally abused man

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Quaddie

The boundaries advice is legit - **to a point.*** People in abusive relationships frequently do have boundary issues....but that's not causative in abuse, either.

Where they're getting it wrong is in treating boundaries as if they are something you "enforce onto" someone else, as in disciplining a child, to try to get *them* to behave differently.

But boundaries are all internal, for your own self. They are not a catapult or barrage of arrows to protect the castle....they are the moat.

It IS really good to work on and learn more about boundaries....but so many are giving it this inappropriate twist that ends up being victim-blaming (blame-shifting). The book I like to recommend is "Boundaries: Where You End and I Begin" by Anne Katherine. 

But again....boundaries are not like rules you enforce onto others. Lack of good boundaries are taken advantage of by abusers. It does not **cause** abuse, and boundaries cannot **fix** an abusive relationship. Except by leaving - which is a healthy self-protective boundary being exercised.

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hoping

Quaddie

I agree with you about the boundaries. We need to use our boundaries to protect ourselves and abusive people are still going to be abusive and try to push or illuminate our boundaries. I agree that when we leave an abusive relationship that we are using a healthy self- protective boundary. Well said Quaddie.

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Bennu
10 hours ago, AZ-home said:

\

When I "put the heat on" he could clean up his actions but not his attitude. So although he's not yelling and complaining left and right...so, he's quiet,...he was more frustrated than ever because he's still having those same thoughts. He's aggravated with everything I do, complaining in his head but stuffing it down. It was actually worse because he was holding stuff in. He was angry, and seething, and you could see him boiling on the inside. He was quiet but scary. This lead to him avoiding me, giving me the silent treatment and sometimes he would pop a cork and all that goo would come out at once. He was a volcano. It was no improvement. It was just a different style of anger and abuse. 

That's what I dealt with when I "wouldn't put up with it". The only real way to not put up with it is to leave.

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Melinoe
45 minutes ago, Bennu said:

That's what I dealt with when I "wouldn't put up with it". The only real way to not put up with it is to leave.

Amen to this! 

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JamesF
On 8/9/2017 at 4:39 AM, hoping said:

I have felt frustrated when I tell people about my husband being abusive and they don't understand how I feel. I think that the ones that are going through it or have gone through it can understand it better. I agree with Quaddie that you can't stop them from being an abusive person. Abusive people can change the way they act by being nicer, abusing you about something else, by being more covert in their abuse but they are still abusers. They are still the same inside. They would have to change how they think before they can change. I was told by a counselor that thoughts come first, then emotions and then our actions. Abusers have abusive thoughts which make them act like they do. It use to be more difficult for me to see how my husband continued to be abusive but it is getting easier. I use to get my hopes up that he was changing a lot because of his actions but as time went on I still saw abuse and I was able to clarify it easier. 

Well I finally had a short talk where I said I wanted a divorce. It could've gone a lot better but could've been worse. Of course she fake cried while she said I'm not a real man blah blah. She stormed out and left. It feels very good to get that monkey off my back. 

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hoping

Yes, I bet it does. I'm glad you were able to get her to leave. I hope you take time to heal and continue to discover the red flags of abuse so you can find a good relationship.  

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JamesF

She's only left temporary she'll be back so I'll have a tough time sleeping. But yes I plan to take my time and hopefully she doesn't go the messy route in the divorce.

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hoping

Oh, I misunderstood. I hope you can find a way to live in a separate place from her. 

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Confused714

That's great that you got that step over with. I'm sure things will be tough for awhile but you took the first step in that direction. I haven't done that yet. I gave him one more chance to change even though I know it's not possible without him actually getting help. I'm preparing for when it happens. I hope you can get her out without to much problems. 

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AZ-home

You're more brave than me. I couldn't look him in the face and do it. I was (and am) very scared of him and knew he would cause a big drama scene. Still it was the hardest thing I've ever done.

Her saying "you're not a man" is a low blow. It's abusive. More proof you are doing the right thing. I'm sorry you're going through this but you're doing a good job. Hang in there. 

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Quaddie

Wow, big step! I hope it goes as smoothly as possible from here..  Be prepared for her hoovers... promises to change, sad pleading she can't be without you she's sorry she'll change she needs your help to get through this how could you abandon her in her time of need blahblahblah

 

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JamesF

So today she asked me if I still wanted to get a divorce and it knocked me back. I don't understand I was clear and left no room for question. I guess this is a sign of her different reality she's in? She said she's not leaving until I blah blah. I'm not sure what to do or what my rights are because she is forcing me to force her out. :/

 

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Quaddie

That's typical - they truly do live in a different sort of reality created by their mindset. (In fact, I just wrote about that in another post, lol.) 

Have you spoken to a lawyer yet? They can advise you of your rights in getting her to leave. 

Meantime, you're probably safe in saying, "Yes, I'm not changing my mind. You have until _________ date to move out."  

If you don't give her a deadline (and stick to it, and have the means to somehow stick to it)... then they will  stay forever. Witness we have members who broke up with their partners months or year(s) ago and the abuser is still living with them and won't leave. You may need to move and get rid of the home out from under her. It may be worth it - something to consider.

 

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JamesF
4 hours ago, Quaddie said:

That's typical - they truly do live in a different sort of reality created by their mindset. (In fact, I just wrote about that in another post, lol.) 

Have you spoken to a lawyer yet? They can advise you of your rights in getting her to leave. 

Meantime, you're probably safe in saying, "Yes, I'm not changing my mind. You have until _________ date to move out."  

If you don't give her a deadline (and stick to it, and have the means to somehow stick to it)... then they will  stay forever. Witness we have members who broke up with their partners months or year(s) ago and the abuser is still living with them and won't leave. You may need to move and get rid of the home out from under her. It may be worth it - something to consider.

 

When she asked that I was scared I realized again that she is not rational and is in another reality. I don't see the logic in staying somewhere you aren't wanted. 

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Quaddie

Because they don't care if you want them, or not. You're supposed to be their thingie. To do and be for them. You're not a separate, unique individual whose desires and needs matter apart from fulfilling their own. They don't see or respect you as a separate, unique individual.

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JamesF

I must've reread this entire thread 30 times in the last couple months. I again had to read it this morning. She's telling friends to pray for me and she feels bad for me because he won't find what he's needing. It hurt to hear. She also thinks she's only partially to blame. She's also had people message me to try and guilt trip me about wanting out. It's made me start second guessing if I will ever be happy. I know right now isn't the time to think, but I'm only human and need love. 

I did see another lawyer and am now armed with knowledge that will greatly help. I just can't shake the guilt and fear.

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AZ-home

Bles your heart James, now she's using spiritual abuse! This is what they do. Mine did the same. The people she is sending to speak to you are her flying monkeys, sent to manipulate you so she can have HER way! At the end of the day it's all about what she wants and needs. I just broke up with a "healthy" guy I was dating. He wants what is best for me. And I want what is best for him. What a contrast! Does she seem to want to make your life easier and want to help you and give you what will be best for you? 

The flying monkeys are clueless and mean well but at the end of the day they are being manipulated (and dont realize it) to "get through to you." Do they want what is best for you? Or for her? 

Religion to follow:

In the end it was the Christian flying by monkeys that brought me to my knees. They ganged up on me telling me how wrong I was to end this marriage. I was breaking a covenant made before God and that was a serious offense. Their attack on my morals came when I was already at my lowest and caused me to have an anxiety attack and I fear all of them to this day because of how badly they hurt me.

X destroyed my character. I had to move to a new community where people didn't know me and start over. I hope that doesn't happen to you but it could. She is traveling down that path.

Narcissists are a sham. Fake! You're the first level to see it. The others don't know yet. If you try to defend yourself you start to look crazy and whatever it is she is telling them about you. You play right into her hands. I found the more I said the worse it got. My therapist said to stop defending my character. I was crushed. Really? Sit back and let him destroy all that I've built about myself? 

Yep

It was and is so hard. But a year or more later people are finally stating to see through him. And see the real me.

I turned to God because I had no one else. This divorce and dealing with a narcissist has made me a much better Christian. People say he is a much better Christian too (I'm no contact but I get crumbs of information sometimes). If we are both stronger Christians, I see that as "all things work together for good for those that love the Lord." I know that seems far away right now. But I just wanted to give a scenario of how God takes bad things like divorces and can use it for good.

You know what message God sent me over and over when my Christian community turned on me? He is rescuing me. He's got me safe in His arms. And it was true. Listen to God. 

The YouTuber who reallly encourages me is TDJakes. Look him up. God doesn't want you to be emotionally abused! He wants more for you than that. You have a purpose and it's not to be someone's  slave or emotional punching bag. God will forgive you for ending the marriage because we ALL sin and make mistakes. Even the pastors!  God showed me over and over while dating why I shouldn't marry the man I did. I disobeyed back then. So now, making this tough decision, He forgives you. It's not the unforgivable sin. Maybe he heard your cries for help and is rescuing you! 

2 Peter 2:7  God also rescued Lot out of Sodom because he was a righteous man who was sick of the shameful immorality of the wicked people around him.

2 Samuel 22:18  He rescued me from my powerful enemies, from those who hated me and were too strong for me.

Duteronomy 26: 6When the Egyptians oppressed and humiliated us by making us their slaves, 7we cried out to the LORD, the God of our ancestors. He heard our cries and saw our hardship, toil, and oppression. 8So the LORD brought us out of Egypt with a strong hand and powerful arm, with overwhelming terror, and with miraculous signs and wonders. 9He brought us to this place and gave us this land flowing with milk and honey!

This is a powerful thing I learned recently: So as God led them (the Israelites)  out of Egypt they crossed the Red Sea on dry land. Then the waters closed back up. It wasn't so much to kill Pharaohs men but so that they could never go back no matter how bad they wanted to. We all get weak and want to go back to the familiar. To the slavery and abuse: Life in the desert was going to be hard. But God has got this. He has got you. He doesn't want you to go back to what He is rescuing you from. Ever watch Intervention and the addiction gets clean and life is better and then they go back to using and you're like NOOOOO! WHY? You did all that work and life was getting better! Remember that. That's what God says when we run back to what He just rescued us from. Lean on Him. He will get you through just like he did me. 

Proverbs 3: 5Trust in the Lord with all your heart and lean not on your own understanding; 6in all your ways submit to him, and he will make your paths straight.a

I am proof of this promise. Hang in there James.

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JamesF
On 8/19/2017 at 10:45 AM, AZ-home said:

Bles your heart James, now she's using spiritual abuse! This is what they do. Mine did the same. The people she is sending to speak to you are her flying monkeys, sent to manipulate you so she can have HER way! At the end of the day it's all about what she wants and needs. I just broke up with a "healthy" guy I was dating. He wants what is best for me. And I want what is best for him. What a contrast! Does she seem to want to make your life easier and want to help you and give you what will be best for you? 

The flying monkeys are clueless and mean well but at the end of the day they are being manipulated (and dont realize it) to "get through to you." Do they want what is best for you? Or for her? 

Religion to follow:

In the end it was the Christian flying by monkeys that brought me to my knees. They ganged up on me telling me how wrong I was to end this marriage. I was breaking a covenant made before God and that was a serious offense. Their attack on my morals came when I was already at my lowest and caused me to have an anxiety attack and I fear all of them to this day because of how badly they hurt me.

X destroyed my character. I had to move to a new community where people didn't know me and start over. I hope that doesn't happen to you but it could. She is traveling down that path.

Narcissists are a sham. Fake! You're the first level to see it. The others don't know yet. If you try to defend yourself you start to look crazy and whatever it is she is telling them about you. You play right into her hands. I found the more I said the worse it got. My therapist said to stop defending my character. I was crushed. Really? Sit back and let him destroy all that I've built about myself? 

Yep

It was and is so hard. But a year or more later people are finally stating to see through him. And see the real me.

I turned to God because I had no one else. This divorce and dealing with a narcissist has made me a much better Christian. People say he is a much better Christian too (I'm no contact but I get crumbs of information sometimes). If we are both stronger Christians, I see that as "all things work together for good for those that love the Lord." I know that seems far away right now. But I just wanted to give a scenario of how God takes bad things like divorces and can use it for good.

You know what message God sent me over and over when my Christian community turned on me? He is rescuing me. He's got me safe in His arms. And it was true. Listen to God. 

The YouTuber who reallly encourages me is TDJakes. Look him up. God doesn't want you to be emotionally abused! He wants more for you than that. You have a purpose and it's not to be someone's  slave or emotional punching bag. God will forgive you for ending the marriage because we ALL sin and make mistakes. Even the pastors!  God showed me over and over while dating why I shouldn't marry the man I did. I disobeyed back then. So now, making this tough decision, He forgives you. It's not the unforgivable sin. Maybe he heard your cries for help and is rescuing you! 

2 Peter 2:7  God also rescued Lot out of Sodom because he was a righteous man who was sick of the shameful immorality of the wicked people around him.

2 Samuel 22:18  He rescued me from my powerful enemies, from those who hated me and were too strong for me.

Duteronomy 26: 6When the Egyptians oppressed and humiliated us by making us their slaves, 7we cried out to the LORD, the God of our ancestors. He heard our cries and saw our hardship, toil, and oppression. 8So the LORD brought us out of Egypt with a strong hand and powerful arm, with overwhelming terror, and with miraculous signs and wonders. 9He brought us to this place and gave us this land flowing with milk and honey!

This is a powerful thing I learned recently: So as God led them (the Israelites)  out of Egypt they crossed the Red Sea on dry land. Then the waters closed back up. It wasn't so much to kill Pharaohs men but so that they could never go back no matter how bad they wanted to. We all get weak and want to go back to the familiar. To the slavery and abuse: Life in the desert was going to be hard. But God has got this. He has got you. He doesn't want you to go back to what He is rescuing you from. Ever watch Intervention and the addiction gets clean and life is better and then they go back to using and you're like NOOOOO! WHY? You did all that work and life was getting better! Remember that. That's what God says when we run back to what He just rescued us from. Lean on Him. He will get you through just like he did me. 

Proverbs 3: 5Trust in the Lord with all your heart and lean not on your own understanding; 6in all your ways submit to him, and he will make your paths straight.a

I am proof of this promise. Hang in there James.

Thank you for all the kind words it brought tears to my eyes when I initially read it. To answer your question, it seems like since I can remember she thinks she knows what is best. A few months ago she asked what my needs are but didn't make any changes. It's about her needs and what's best for her. I'm guessing it's part of the "my day was worse than yours no matter what. I always felt she needed to 1 up me, or downplay any good news, or wouldn't seem happy at all. It got to where she would be fine and boom look for something to be mad about and pull us down to chaos. It's so exhausting to my spirit. I get nervous going home since she's still there for now. 

I chose to believe he heard me over and over say "god I'm sorry but I do not want to have kids with this woman". I'm not sure how I started connecting the dots on truly how toxic and verbal and emotional sometimes spiritual abuse is. When I started reading all the replies to my initial post I was shocked and terrified at hope y'all think it's a bad very damaging thing to be in. I don't want to call it a relationship because if she is a narc, everything was a mask. You're right I believe I'm being saved bad a bad marriage. I've asked God to forgive me over and over. I just want to be free, happy, and live my life to its fullest. People have told me how they waited and stayed too long and wish they'd left sooner, which helps. The Christian in me wishes still I could just reach her and help but my efforts have failed. I will lean on god like you said and will watch the td jakes videos. Some of the ones I watched sounded like he was talking about her like she was in the front row. I'll be ok I'll just have to take one day at a time and try to get out of the house more. 

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AZ-home

My biggest life lesson of my marriage was: you can't change other people. It's my job to work on me and their job to work on them. I take this into my friendships now. So don't beat yourself up. It's not your job to save her from herself.  

"You can't control the wind but you can adjust your sails." - sailors 

 

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JamesF

I keep having setbacks I'm sorry to keep replying over and over almost the same thing. Im starting to second guess if maybe I was verbal at times. I sometimes read what she tells friends, probably not good to do but it gives me an idea of how she thinks. She claims to have been forgiven by god so I must forgive and forget. When I said I can't forget, she said well then you don't really forgive me. To make things worse she's still here and seems to not be in a hurry to leave. I'm second guessing if I gave up too soon or if it's half my fault. I for some reason care what people think of me and I feel like all of her friends think I'm this terrible person. It hurts my heart. One of there boyfriends called me a wimp(he used another word) because I said she verbally abused me along with other ways. I shouldn't have told her that every I guess everything I say backfires on me with her. I don't understand how a man is automatically weak for "allowing" it. She even said I pushed her buttons and got mad when she raged, which is not true. Pushing buttons is not something I like to do its mean and cruel. I won't say I've never done it, but 99% of the time I'm not, why expend the energy to do that?

 

I've tried to stay away from home as often as possible but I wish she would just leave.

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AZ-home
32 minutes ago, JamesF said:

I keep having setbacks I'm sorry to keep replying over and over almost the same thing. Im starting to second guess if maybe I was verbal at times.

This is so normal. We all feel responsible and are told we are responsible so we're getting it from 2 places. 

34 minutes ago, JamesF said:

 She claims to have been forgiven by god so I must forgive and forget.

First of all. Spiritual abuse again! Also tell me one bible verse that says forgive and forget. Forgive yes. But the secular world added "and forget." You will never forget. It's our body's defense mechanism. She doesn't sound humble and is DEMANDING that you FORGIVE! That's not how it works honey! She should be humbling herself before you, asking your forgiveness, and not do it anymore and then be patient while you heal. For her to demand you just get over it already, is abusive. It's in the abuse books. I have been forgiving my unrepentant relative who feels they are not wrong, I have been forgiving for my own mental health over and over for years now. It's ongoing. I will never forget. I am trying to heal and understand their point of view and how they thought they were helping me but harmed me instead. I try "forgive them they know now what they do." Forgiveness is a privilege and she needs to be patient. 
 

38 minutes ago, JamesF said:

To make things worse she's still here and seems to not be in a hurry to leave.

Manipulation. Maybe someone else can advise you how to get her out. 

41 minutes ago, JamesF said:

I for some reason care what people think of me and I feel like all of her friends think I'm this terrible person. It hurts my heart.

I was this way too, pre-divorce. My therapist helped me with this. You're a classic people pleaser aka co-dependent and she is the classic narcissist. If you go forward with this divorce you WILL lose those people. You will lose all her people. They will side with her and support her and she will need those people to keep from going REALLY insane so consider that collateral damage. This was hard for me too. I had never pissed people off before. I bend over backwards to help everyone and make everyone like me. But in a divorce you lose people. You may also lose a few of YOUR people which is what happened to me! Hence, the forgiveness challenge I mentioned earlier. A close family member sided with my ex and believed his lies and slander. It's a wound I really struggle with. I went from everybody loved me to people thinking I'm a sleeping around ho. Start now letting some people go. 

         "I don't know the key to success, but the key to failure is trying to please everybody." -My cousin

50 minutes ago, JamesF said:

One of there boyfriends called me a wimp(he used another word) because I said she verbally abused me along with other ways. I shouldn't have told her that every I guess everything I say backfires on me with her. I don't understand how a man is automatically weak for "allowing" it.

This is the ugly part of being a man abused by a female. It's wrong. They're wrong! They don't know what they're talking about. She is showing them her sweet victim mask. They have NO IDEA what she's like to live with! You're not allowing it. You're standing up to her and making a stand to save yourself from her crazy torment of you! You rock! Don't listen to this BS! People like that are in the dark about abuse. Plain and simple! YOU understand your situation SO much better than them. I find that few people believe in or understand verbal/emotional abuse, and most don't think it can happen to a strong man. They are clueless! I'm sorry they said that but they weren't your "friends" anyway so let that go. Let them go.

57 minutes ago, JamesF said:

She even said I pushed her buttons and got mad when she raged, which is not true. Pushing buttons is not something I like to do its mean and cruel. I won't say I've never done it, but 99% of the time I'm not, why expend the energy to do that?

Victim blaming is a classic abuser tactic.

"You made me do it!"  

"If you would just ______ I wouldn't have to [abuse]"

"You pushed my buttons"

Most of us are walking on eggshells and STILL pissing them off left and right. My x was UNpleasable! There is nothing I can do to make him happy. Everything I did was wrong and he thought I had motives for doing "bad" things.  She sounds exactly like him. It's wild how they are all basically the same regardless of the gender. 

I'd stay gone a lot too. It's what I did. I was in much better shape back then because I was in the gym a lot. Now our adult son is doing that to avoid his dad. He will never change.

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JamesF
40 minutes ago, AZ-home said:

This is so normal. We all feel responsible and are told we are responsible so we're getting it from 2 places. 

First of all. Spiritual abuse again! Also tell me one bible verse that says forgive and forget. Forgive yes. But the secular world added "and forget." You will never forget. It's our body's defense mechanism. She doesn't sound humble and is DEMANDING that you FORGIVE! That's not how it works honey! She should be humbling herself before you, asking your forgiveness, and not do it anymore and then be patient while you heal. For her to demand you just get over it already, is abusive. It's in the abuse books. I have been forgiving my unrepentant relative who feels they are not wrong, I have been forgiving for my own mental health over and over for years now. It's ongoing. I will never forget. I am trying to heal and understand their point of view and how they thought they were helping me but harmed me instead. I try "forgive them they know now what they do." Forgiveness is a privilege and she needs to be patient. 
 

Manipulation. Maybe someone else can advise you how to get her out. 

I was this way too, pre-divorce. My therapist helped me with this. You're a classic people pleaser aka co-dependent and she is the classic narcissist. If you go forward with this divorce you WILL lose those people. You will lose all her people. They will side with her and support her and she will need those people to keep from going REALLY insane so consider that collateral damage. This was hard for me too. I had never pissed people off before. I bend over backwards to help everyone and make everyone like me. But in a divorce you lose people. You may also lose a few of YOUR people which is what happened to me! Hence, the forgiveness challenge I mentioned earlier. A close family member sided with my ex and believed his lies and slander. It's a wound I really struggle with. I went from everybody loved me to people thinking I'm a sleeping around ho. Start now letting some people go. 

         "I don't know the key to success, but the key to failure is trying to please everybody." -My cousin

This is the ugly part of being a man abused by a female. It's wrong. They're wrong! They don't know what they're talking about. She is showing them her sweet victim mask. They have NO IDEA what she's like to live with! You're not allowing it. You're standing up to her and making a stand to save yourself from her crazy torment of you! You rock! Don't listen to this BS! People like that are in the dark about abuse. Plain and simple! YOU understand your situation SO much better than them. I find that few people believe in or understand verbal/emotional abuse, and most don't think it can happen to a strong man. They are clueless! I'm sorry they said that but they weren't your "friends" anyway so let that go. Let them go.

Victim blaming is a classic abuser tactic.

"You made me do it!"  

"If you would just ______ I wouldn't have to [abuse]"

"You pushed my buttons"

Most of us are walking on eggshells and STILL pissing them off left and right. My x was UNpleasable! There is nothing I can do to make him happy. Everything I did was wrong and he thought I had motives for doing "bad" things.  She sounds exactly like him. It's wild how they are all basically the same regardless of the gender. 

I'd stay gone a lot too. It's what I did. I was in much better shape back then because I was in the gym a lot. Now our adult son is doing that to avoid his dad. He will never change.

She didn't demand I forgive and forget, she just said that since God forgave and forgot her sins I can't hold it against her anymore. Yes this sounds very convenient and unfair to me. I forgive her but I'm not sure about forget, to me to do that is like saying it's ok. 

There have been a few times where I lashed out at her and berated her, but those few times are nothing compared to the many. She mostly did it behind closed doors and ironically said "he brings me to tears just not when y'all are around"

 

It makes me feel like I'm crazy and the problem. 

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JamesF
On 8/30/2017 at 11:38 AM, AZ-home said:

 

 

How do you tell the difference in getting fleas and being the abusive one too? I'm struggling with some of the things I've said that were in retrospect abusive like calling her crazy, saying she needs meds, and a few other things. I feel like a terrible person. I don't understand how my few transgressions are being pointed out but her many are forgotten by her. 

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Melinoe
57 minutes ago, JamesF said:

How do you tell the difference in getting fleas and being the abusive one too? I'm struggling with some of the things I've said that were in retrospect abusive like calling her crazy, saying she needs meds, and a few other things. I feel like a terrible person. I don't understand how my few transgressions are being pointed out but her many are forgotten by her. 

I think the main difference is that you recognize the behavior as problematic and feel bad about it. You are looking deeply into your actions and what they say about you. An abusive person doesn't do that. Even if they are "so sorry" after an abusive event, they won't take time to reflect and get introspective about what happened - not in a genuine way. They might appear to do it, as manipulation, for sympathy and attention, but not with any kind of authenticity. So if you're sitting there agonizing over what you said and did, having an existential crisis about who you have become and what's going on, I'd say you're not abusive. When you catch yourself taken aback by the things you're doing and saying and are quite aware that you shouldn't do those things, and you feel that sense of "wrongness" - that's a sign you've got fleas. 

I once had a friend of mine give me a great quote that I feel expresses how any kind of abusive, manipulative, toxic relationship can affect one's personality: "When you're in Crazy Town, you live by crazy rules". You start doing and saying things that you don't want to do, but that follow the rules of the relationship. The "fleas" is like a survival technique. You become so used to the unhealthy standard of the relationship that you start to play by those rules, even though it feels gross and you hate yourself for it. Because those are the only rules you have to work with, in Crazy Town. 

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Quaddie

That's a good analogy

 

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